[QTI] Re: Recording

Engin Koc sengin_koc at yahoo.com
Tue Oct 17 07:41:30 BST 2006
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Dear Yvonne,
  Thank you very much. Looks like we are using the same type of interaction. I wonder how you define it using CustomInteraction. Unfortunately the attachments you sent were scrubbed. Could you please send the same attachments to my email?  And I wonder how we can show the recording time or any time related response in reporting. Thank you again. 
  Best Regards
  Engin Koc
  

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2006 12:30:08 +0200
From: "Yvonne Winkelmann" 
Subject: Re: [QTI] Re: Recording
To: "IMS Question & Test Interoperability"

Message-ID: <20061016103008.155330 at gmx.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"


Hello Engin Koc,

we are dealing with a similar problem like you making an interaction which describes a recorded response. The learner has to play an audio sequence which contains questions and short breaks in which the learner has to speak his response. That means the recording time is the same like the playing time of the audio file and so we haven't got problems to define the recording time.

Our solution was to define a customInteraction which is really simple because we need only a label which advise the application how to interpret the interaction and an own audio-tag. Maybe we would like to use the "object" html tag but we don't want to jumble qti tags inside a customInteraction.

I have attached our item xml code, the xsd code of our schema definition and a figure how it looks like to this mail. Hopefully it helps you.

Recards
Yvonne 

-- 
Yvonne Winkelmann
Dipl. Medien-Informatikerin

BPS Bildungsportal Sachsen GmbH
Bahnhofstraße 6
09111 Chemnitz

web: http://www.bps-system.de

------------------------------------
-------- Original-Nachricht --------
Datum: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 23:06:56 -0700 (PDT)
Von: Engin Koc 
An: ims-qti at lists.ucles.org.uk
Betreff: [QTI] Re:Recording and Origin of Coords

> Marina, Thank you very much for sharing this with me I learned more from
> you then helping you:) And thank you Steve, I have another question Is it
> possible to define the time dependence of questions as extensions because I
> want to define my questions' time dependence as "time taken to read" "time
> to answer the first question" or "time interval to record the question" so
> that later I can get the user's responses as statistics to improve the
> questions? I didnt check customInteraction or endAttemptInteraction but I will
> write this
> You said:
> "There are ways that you could achieve the use cases you refer to,
> though it
> is always difficult to determine if users really have done what they say
> they have (such as reading a passage of text)."
> I say:
> Maybe a button can be put to let the learner control the time when the
> question appears or maybe the question can automatically come after letting
> the learner read for a time interval.
> Thanks a lot again. It's been very helpful.
> Best Regards
> Engin Koc 
> ims-qti-request at lists.ucles.org.uk wrote:
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> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
> 1. Re: Origin of Coords (Engin Koc)
> 2. Re: Re: Origin of Coords (Marina Zelwer)
> 3. Re: origin for coords (Steve Lay)
> 4. Re: Recording (Steve Lay)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 05:30:02 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Engin Koc 
> Subject: [QTI] Re: Origin of Coords
> To: ims-qti at lists.ucles.org.uk
> Message-ID: <20061004123002.70437.qmail at web50614.mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Dear Marina
> I havent seen a real example but as far as I know, when we use x0 with we
> define the coords according to the left bottom of the page so I believe it
> is the same for any specific place on an image object.
> Best Regards
> Engin Koc
> 
> 
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
> 1. origin for coords (Marina Zelwer)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2006 12:40:48 +0200
> From: Marina Zelwer 
> Subject: [QTI] origin for coords
> To: "IMS Question & Test Interoperability"
> 
> Message-ID: <45238FB0.2050909 at univ-st-etienne.fr>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I'm working on selectPointInteraction and I didn't manage to find how we 
> can know to which origin the coords apply. Is it the left-top corner of 
> the image object ? The left-bottom ?
> 
> Best regards,
> Marina
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> IMS-QTI mailing list
> IMS-QTI at lists.ucles.org.uk
> http://lists.ucles.org.uk/lists/listinfo/ims-qti
> 
> 
> End of IMS-QTI Digest, Vol 27, Issue 2
> **************************************
> 
> 
> 
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> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2006 14:57:44 +0200
> From: Marina Zelwer 
> Subject: Re: [QTI] Re: Origin of Coords
> To: "IMS Question & Test Interoperability"
> 
> Message-ID: <4523AFC8.4080000 at univ-st-etienne.fr>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
> 
> Thanks for your answer.
> 
> I finally found some information in here (I was previously looking in 
> XHTML1 doc and couldn't find it) : 
> http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml2/mod-csImgMap.html#s_csImgMapmodule
> "coords = Coordinates
> This attribute specifies the position and shape of the area. The 
> number and order of values depends on the value of the shape attribute. 
> Possible combinations:
> 
> * rect: left-x, top-y, right-x, bottom-y.
> * circle: center-x, center-y, radius. When the radius value is 
> a percentage, the actual radius value is calculated using the associated 
> image's width and height. The radius is then the smaller value of the two.
> * poly: x1, y1, x2, y2, ..., xN, yN. If the first and last x 
> and y coordinate pairs are not the same, user agents must infer an 
> additional coordinate pair to close the polygon.
> Coordinates are relative to the top, left corner of the object. All 
> values are of type Length. All values are separated by commas. The 
> coordinates of the top, left corner of an area are 0, 0."
> 
> As it is said in the QTI documentation that they want to stay compliant 
> with the XHTML specification for the coords and shape attributes I 
> suppose this information above also applies to QTI coords attribute.
> 
> Best regards
> Marina
> 
> Engin Koc a écrit :
> > Dear Marina
> > I havent seen a real example but as far as I know, when we use x0 with 
> > we define the coords according to the left bottom of the page 
> > so I believe it is the same for any specific place on an image object.
> > Best Regards
> > Engin Koc
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Today's Topics:
> > 
> > 1. origin for coords (Marina Zelwer)
> > 
> > 
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2006 12:40:48 +0200
> > From: Marina Zelwer
> > Subject: [QTI] origin for coords
> > To: "IMS Question & Test Interoperability"
> > 
> > Message-ID: <45238FB0.2050909 at univ-st-etienne.fr>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> > 
> > Hello,
> > 
> > I'm working on selectPointInteraction and I didn't manage to find
> > how we
> > can know to which origin the coords apply. Is it the left-top corner of
> > the image object ? The left-bottom ?
> > 
> > Best regards,
> > Marina
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ------------------------------
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > IMS-QTI mailing list
> > IMS-QTI at lists.ucles.org.uk
> > http://lists.ucles.org.uk/lists/listinfo/ims-qti
> > 
> > 
> > End of IMS-QTI Digest, Vol 27, Issue 2
> > **************************************
> > 
> > 
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call 
> > rates. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > IMS-QTI mailing list
> > IMS-QTI at lists.ucles.org.uk
> > http://lists.ucles.org.uk/lists/listinfo/ims-qti
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Marina Zelwer
> 
> Centre Commun Multimédia C2M
> Université Jean Monnet
> 2, rue Tréfilerie,
> 42023 Saint Etienne
> Tel : 04.77.42.16.17
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 14:18:56 +0100
> From: Steve Lay 
> Subject: Re: [QTI] origin for coords
> To: "IMS Question & Test Interoperability"
> 
> Message-ID: 
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> At 12:40 +0200 2006-10-04, Marina Zelwer wrote:
> >I'm working on selectPointInteraction and I didn't manage to find how we
> >can know to which origin the coords apply. Is it the left-top corner of
> >the image object ? The left-bottom ?
> 
> QTI inherits its co-ordinate space from (X)HTML.
> 
> For a selectPointInteraction there are two coordinate related issues.
> 
> (1) Firstly, areas may be defined in an areaMapping defined in the
> associated responseDeclaration. In this case, the coordinates are defined
> by the coords type. In the section on "Basic Data Types" the coords type
> is defined as follows:
> 
> "The coordinates themselves are an ordered list of lengths (as defined in
> [XHTML]). The interpretation of each length value is dependent on the
> value
> of the associated shape as follows." - the 2.1 binding has more
> information
> than previous drafts and draws attention to the need to interpret these
> values as HTML lengths and not just pixel values (a length in HTML may be
> a
> percentage).
> 
> The appropriate part of the HTML specification is here:
> 
> http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/objects.html#h-13.6.1
> 
> Which states: "Coordinates are relative to the top, left corner of the
> object. All values are lengths. All values are separated by commas."
> 
> Note that I've included the binding information in this quote as it
> differs
> >from the space-separated convention used for most data types in the
> specification binding (spaces being the convention used in XML schema, on
> which the binding is based).
> 
> (2) Secondly, you may need a coordinate value when representing coordinate
> values returned by the user (e.g., in reports) or in declarations such as
> that of the correctResponse. In this case, you have to use the value
> element. The co-ordinate space is the same but the binding is carried out
> in accordance with the rules in the XML binding document, section "Binding
> Values of Item Variables". This states that 'point' is bound as:
> 
> "A space separated list of two integer values, bound in the same was as
> the
> XML schema type int. The first value is the horizontal component, the
> second the vertical."
> 
> Note also that lengths are not allowed so you *can't* report a user
> clicked
> point of "50% 50%" indicating that the user clicked in the centre of the
> image even though you can use this form to define a shape in an
> areaMapping, e.g. shape="circle" coords="50% 50% 10" which indicates a
> centred circle of radius 10 pixels.
> 
> Hope that helps.
> 
> Steve
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 14:51:55 +0100
> From: Steve Lay 
> Subject: Re: [QTI] Recording
> To: "IMS Question & Test Interoperability"
> 
> Cc: Engin Koc 
> Message-ID: 
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> At 23:07 -0700 2006-10-02, Engin Koc wrote:
> >Does anyone know how we define the metadata of questions that involve
> >recording (such as speech-recording) that will be evaluated by an
> >instructor later. Also is it possible to seperate the time taken by a
> user
> >to read a passage, to read questions, to answer them as metadata both in
> >results reporting and as questions' own metadata.
> 
> I don't think the information you are after is metadata, it should be part
> of the question content.
> 
> There are ways that you could achieve the use cases you refer to, though
> it
> is always difficult to determine if users really have done what they say
> they have (such as reading a passage of text).
> 
> Sounds like you need a time-dependent adaptive item which displays the
> passage and requires confirmation (though an endAttemptInteraction) before
> displaying the question and likewise before providing them with the
> interaction that obtains the answer itself. At each point, you can capture
> and test the value of the duration (recording them in separate outcomes if
> desired) during response processing.
> 
> However, the big issue is that we don't have an interaction type which
> describes a recorded response in the specification so if the response was
> verbal (or involved making some other type of recorded sound) then you
> would need to create a customInteraction to represent this.
> 
> Hope that helps.
> 
> Steve
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
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> IMS-QTI at lists.ucles.org.uk
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> 
> 
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> **************************************
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